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Old 10-22-2004, 05:29 PM   #21
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Default Re: Ik geef je brood, maar je moet eerst Christen worden.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vishal
Gedwongen bekeren is onzin, je kan niet ineens iets anders geloven omdat iemand je brood geeft, want geloven doe je vanuit je verstand. Het is onzin om te zeggen dat je eerst in reincarnatie geloofde, maar omdat iemand je een brood geeft, geloof je nu in hemel/hel. Als je je zo snel laat "bekeren" is het maar de vraag of je uberhaupt ooit echt hebt geloofd.
mang!!
dus als iemand dat tegen me zegt zeg ik": over my dead body!!
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Old 10-22-2004, 05:38 PM   #22
- Prem -
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Default Re: Ik geef je brood, maar je moet eerst Christen worden.



Als alle Hindoes uit vrije wil Christen worden, zou ik dat niet erg vinden. Want dat is hun vrije keuze. Waar het bij mij om gaat is de manier die Christenen gebruiken om de Hindoes te bekeren. Dus de methode. Wat vinden jullie daarvan? Is dat eerlijk en menswaardig?

En trouwens ook al heeft iemand nooit in iets geloofd. Dus een atheist. Dezelfde manieren worden ook bij deze personen gebruikt. Hindoe of geen Hindoe.





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Old 10-22-2004, 05:41 PM   #23
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Default Re: Ik geef je brood, maar je moet eerst Christen worden.

Als ik een arme Indier zou zijn en een Christen kwam me bekeren zou ik zeggen; okay, ik ben christen, now give me the damn bread ! * ;D

Krijg ik er ook warme soep bij..?
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Old 10-22-2004, 05:41 PM   #24
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Default Re: Ik geef je brood, maar je moet eerst Christen worden.

Quote:
Originally Posted by - Prem -


Als alle Hindoes uit vrije wil Christen worden, zou ik dat niet erg vinden. Want dat is hun vrije keuze. Waar het bij mij om gaat is de manier die Christenen gebruiken om de Hindoes te bekeren. Dus de methode. Wat vinden jullie daarvan? Is dat eerlijk en menswaardig?

En trouwens ook al heeft iemand nooit in iets geloofd. Dus een atheist. Dezelfde manieren worden ook bij deze personen gebruikt. Hindoe of geen Hindoe.





ik ben zowiezo tegn het opleggen van een geloof aan iemand anders met een ander geloof
ALs het vrijwillig is, dan no problem
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Old 10-22-2004, 05:42 PM   #25
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Default Re: Ik geef je brood, maar je moet eerst Christen worden.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arjun
Als ik een arme Indier zou zijn en een Christen kwam me bekeren zou ik zeggen; okay, ik ben christen, now give me the damn bread ! * ;D
hahahaha
nee ik niet
ik ga echt liever dood
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Old 10-22-2004, 05:44 PM   #26
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Default Re: Ik geef je brood, maar je moet eerst Christen worden.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arjun
Als ik een arme Indier zou zijn en een Christen kwam me bekeren zou ik zeggen; okay, ik ben christen, now give me the damn bread ! * ;D

Krijg ik er ook warme soep bij..?

wie weet moet jet niet alleen zeggen maar ook iets doen......soort v inwijdingsdinges....... misschien wel net als sunny deol in gadar....je eigen dharm belachelijk maken :( dat maakt t iets moeilijker
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Old 10-22-2004, 08:01 PM   #27
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Default Re: Ik geef je brood, maar je moet eerst Christen worden.

meer informatie............

Conversion Tactics – Sexual Abuse



American Missionary Joseph Cooper and his wife, who kidnapped and
raped a 12 year old Hindu girl, now walk free in America

The press has recently revealed of the sexual exploitation of children in churches in the United States by the clergy. However, the sexual crimes against children and others outside the U.S. rarely make news. There are many cases of perverted Missionaries sexually exploited non-Christians and using this as a conversion tactic.

1. Sodomy - On November 11, 2000 Indian police arrested David Berry, a 51 year old British national for brutally sodomizing and perpetrating savage sexual abuse on at least 11 minor Hindu boys in the holy temple town of Puri, Orissa. Berry was assisted in his heinous crimes by Bijoy Behera, a local schoolteacher and recent convert to Christianity. The police were forced to arrest the two Christians following a complaint lodged by a victim's father, Shree Banamali Senapati. Initially despite his lodging of the complaint, the police dismissed the case and refused to arrest the perpetrators, but were forced to act when an angry mob from the town besieged them and threatened dire consequences if the guilty were not punished. Shree Senapati was in tears as he related how Berry had sodomized his traumatized 12-year-old son at least eight times in his hotel room and elsewhere. The boy related to the police that Berry had forced him to have oral sex and kept him a virtual prisoner in the hotel room for hours. He also revealed that the Briton had sodomized at least 10 other school children, all below the ages of 12. The children were so traumatized by Berry's threats and Behera's beatings that they did not dare to confess to the horrors visited upon them until young master Senapati could take no more and broke down to his father.

2. Stripping - On October 9, 2000 a group of converted Christians stripped a 12-year-old tribal Hindu boy and paraded him naked in Gasukia village after he opposed attempts to convert him to Christianity. He was taken to the village school and brutally beaten for "refusing to accept Jesus as his savior". This event naturally led to communal tension as the Hindus were outraged at the heinous crimes being forced on them.

3. Rape – In January 2002, American Missionary Reverend Joseph Cooper was expelled from India after being found guilty of raping a young Hindu girl. Cooper currently walks free and as a preacher in Connecticut. Western Media only reported how Hindus had retaliated against Cooper after the rape but Cooper’s crime was never mentioned.

In another incident, American Pastor Benson Sam and his wife Sally also were found guilty of abduction and rape of a minor girl. The poor orphan girl had allegedly been sexually abused and harassed for four months at the Bible Christian Centre, which had resulted in the issue of non-bailable warrants against Rev. Sam and his son.

4. Molestation - Hemalata Karua, 32, of Machhagarh village in Keonjhar district in Orissa, India testified in court that Australian Missionary Graham Staines had asked her to convert to Christianity to avoid financial difficulty. He also invited them to a jungle camp to be held at Manoharpur after the Hindu festival of Makar Sankranti. Karua said she and her husband converted to Christianity at the camp on January 21, 1999, and were given new clothes. They also attended a prayer meeting and a film on Christian faith that evening. Later, they were served beef at dinner, which she refused to eat, she claimed. She did mention that neither she nor her husband had been offered any money by the missionary to change their faith. Stating that she stayed alone in a hut behind the local church that night, Karua alleged that the missionary came there later and attempted to grope and rape her. She informed her husband the next morning and they left for their village. Twenty days after the incident, she claimed, the missionary's wife visited her to express regret for his actions.

Summary
There are hundreds more incidents which could have been listed. And there are probably even more that are only known by the victims themselves. Most victims do not report the crimes against them because they feel they will be ostracized by their community. Not only are Missionaries proctected by Western Media, Missionaries keep such scandals from surfacing by bribing local police and by threatening the victims of their heinous crimes. Missionaries serve no benefit to India and when they molest the people they are by no means spreading “the love of God??? but rather acting with their sick and perverted mentality.


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Old 10-22-2004, 10:39 PM   #28
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Default Re: Ik geef je brood, maar je moet eerst Christen worden.

Damn, dit zijn niet eens christenen !
Dit zijn de belichamingen van hun Satan !

Wat erg men... :-\ :-[ :'(
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Old 10-23-2004, 07:49 PM   #29
- Prem -
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Default Re: Ik geef je brood, maar je moet eerst Christen worden.

nog meer info.................

Missionaries often use devious tactics to decieve
innocent villagers in order to convert them.

Christian Missionaries on one hand preach high moral values, yet at the same time, they follow the lowest most despicable ones in order to convert people to their religion. Missionaries especially prey on the poorest, most rural folk under the guise of helping them out of poverty when in fact they have chosen to convert them because they are the most uneducated and therefore most likely to fall for their deception.

1. Fake Medicines – One common tactic employed by Missionaries is to give a sick villager fake medicines which have no medicinal value and ask them to worship in the name of their faith for wellness. After several days, the missionary gives the villager an identical dose of the medicine, but this time it is the real medicine. Then the missionary will instruct the villager to now pray to Jesus. Soon after, due to the medicine and not due to Jesus, the villager will be cured. The uneducated and gullible villager, however, will attribute his cure to Jesus and convert to Christianity.
2. Floating Idols – In rural villages in India, Missionaries and place a stone or metal idol of a Hindu Deity in bring a bucket of water. The statue will sink in the bucket. Next the Missionary bring a wax-coated idol of Jesus or Virgin Mary (though Christianity prohibits idols) and places that in the bucket. Due the wax-coat, the Christian idol will float. The Missionary will then conclude that because the Christian idol floated, it is “higher??? and, therefore, better than the Hindu one. The uneducated villager, not knowing anything about buoyancy or density, falls for the Missionary’s ridiculous explanation and converts to Christianity.

3. Fraudulent Saints – Often Missionaries will disguise themselves as religious leaders of the local religion and subtly attempt to convert the locals.

The classic example was that of Robert de Nobili, a Jesuit from France, who came to India in the early 17th century. He adopted the saffron robe, started to live in a hut, squatted on the floor for conducting his discourses, became a vegetarian and gave up liquor, projected that he was a Brahmin saint from Rome and that the Bible was one of the lost Vedas (Hindu holy scriptures), and generally tried to pass himself as another Hindu sanyasi (saint). He was successful, and many Hindus came to him for spiritual reasons of which many he converted.
Though Nobili used this tactic centuries ago, this deceitful and treacherous method is still in use by Missionaries even today.

4. Blasphemy & Impurity – Another tactic used my Christian is to somehow make the victim impure to their religion in some way. Then the Missionary will convince the victim that they can no longer practice their old faith due to their blasphemy, and therefore they must accept Christianity.

The most infamous incident is known as the “Sepoy Rebellion???. In 1857, British General Lord Canning gave orders for the British to mix crushed cow and pig bones into the salt, butter and sugar rations of his Indian troops. In addition the British greased Enfield rifle cartridges with cow and pig fat. After some time, it was discovered by the troops that the rations they had consumed and the mouth-loaded cartridges had been contaminated with animal fats. This led many devout Hindu and Muslim to believe they were no longer pious members of their respective religions and so many were forced to convert. This outrage led to a massive war-like rebellion by the Hindu and Muslim troops which was eventually quelled by British.

By making one impure to their religion, shows the paramount of hatred and disrespect that Christian Missionaries have for all other religions.

5. Guilt & Accusations – In 1975, Christian Missionaries were unsuccessful in converting the Panare Native Americans of the Colorado Valley. The missionaries had converted the Bible to their native language, but the peaceful and simple tribe could not understand the concepts of sin, guilt, war and plagues. So instead, the missionaries changed the Bible so that instead of the Romans and others, the Panare were responsible for the death of Jesus. One excerpt read:

???The Panare killed Jesus Christ, because they were wicked. Let's kill Jesus Christ, said the Panare. The Panare seized Jesus Christ. The Panare killed in this way. The laid a cross on the ground. They fastened his hands and his feet against the wooden beams, with nails. They raised him straight up, nailed. The man died like that, nailed. Thus the Panare killed Jesus Christ…

God will burn you all, burn all the animals, burn also the earth, the heavens, absolutely everything. He will burn also the Panare themselves. God will exterminate the Panare by throwing them on the fire. It is a huge fire. I am going to hurl the Panare into the fire, said God.???

And the simplistic Panare tribe immediately claimed they loved Jesus, fearing they would be burnt by God. Missionaries seem to go to any extent to convert others, even if it requires gross deception and misrepresentation of their own holy book, the Bible will for the benefit of “winning souls???.

6. False Identities – To convert a more educated and pious individual, a Missionary will pretend that he/she has a religious background that is the same as yours.

For example, a Missionary who is targeting a Hindu may tell the Hindu that he (or a Christian friend or acquaintance) was once an orthodox Hindu, or that he had a solid Hindu education, a traditional Hindu family life, etc. This is almost always an outright lie so that you will open up to him. The hidden message that he is attempting to convey is that he came to believe in Jesus after knowing and overcoming all of the Hindu objections, and therefore, the Hindu he is targeting should also try to follow the same path, (which he never really took).

Usually, all that is necessary to expose this type of hoax is to ask him about various small details of Hindu life that any observant Hindu child would know, and see how he responds. In almost all cases, he will begin to hedge about the extent of his "background" and "Hindu knowledge". Unfortunately, most Hindu or targets of other religions are themselves not knowledgeable enough to be able to expose this type of deception and quite often Missionaries are successful.

7. Secret Baptism – Another tactic that is deceptively employed by Missionaries is to “baptize??? a victim without their knowledge. Then to reveal that they had been baptized and they must convert to Christianity. Though well-documented, it is little known that the most famous perpetrator was Mother Teresa and her sisters.

“For Mother (Teresa), it was the spiritual well-being of the poor that mattered most. Material aid was a means of reaching their souls, of showing the poor that God loved them. In the homes for the dying, Mother taught the sisters how to secretly baptize those who were dying. Sisters were to ask each person in danger of death if he wanted a ‘ticket to heaven’. An affirmative reply was to mean consent to baptism. The sister was then to pretend she was just cooling the person’s forehead with a wet cloth, while in fact she was baptizing him, saying quietly the necessary words. Secrecy was important so that it would not come to be known that Mother Teresa’s sisters were baptizing Hindus and Moslems.???

7. Miracles – One of the most despicable ways of deception is how Missionaries pray on young rural school children. The school bus will stop suddenly. Young kids are told that they must pray 'Krishna' to try and restart it, but it fails to do so. Then they try 'Rama', then 'Guru Nanak', then 'Allah' etc. Finally, after exhausting the common names in India for spiritual authority, they are asked to say 'Jesus' all together, and at that time the bus suddenly starts. Everyone applauds the demonstration of Jesus' love and power.

8. Miracle Boxes – Missionaries will place "Miracle boxes" are put in local churches: The gullible villager writes out a request - a loan, a pucca house, fees for the son's schooling. A few weeks later, the miracle happens, paid for by Western Christian donations. And the whole family converts believing it is a miracle of Jesus, making others in the village follow suit.
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Old 10-24-2004, 04:02 PM   #30
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Default Re: Ik geef je brood, maar je moet eerst Christen worden.

ik geef jou een kwartje als je gaat zingen in je onderbroek
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